To: creationists@egroups.com

Sent: August 23, 2000 10:20 PM

Subject: Textual Critics

Here's a discussion I had on another forum that gave me a chance to use some quotes that are very relevant to this list. If this stuff doesn't convince you to stick with the KJV only, I doubt your salvation, or at least that you have the spiritual discernment of lime jello.

The point is that you all use this verse to show that modern Bibles make Jesus to be a liar. Besides the fact that this is entirely RIDICULOUS.

It is ridiculous to bury your head in the sand and ignore the fact that 95% of the modern versions make Jesus into a LIAR in John 7:8.

Actually, now that I think about it, why would people be putting out these modern Bible versions if they truly either hate or don't believe in God? That does not make sense. If I were going to tear down Christianity (not saying I am or have a desire to do so, I am a Christian, despite what you all say), I would not TRANSLATE A BIBLE!!!

Tearing down Christianity, or the Bible is EXACTLY why they put out some of the versions. You should study the guys behind the modern versions. The modern versions are CHOCK FULL or first rank HERETICS. I'm not talking about a few guys who differ on baby sprinkling or something, I'm talking about them being thoroughly INFESTED with people who don't believe Jesus was God in the flesh, don't believe even the originals were God's word, don't believe the originals were historically accurate, don't believe Jesus performed miracles, don't believe the Genesis creation, don't believe Jesus should be worshipped, etc. etc. ad nauseam. I could show you HUNDREDS of examples from THEIR OWN WRITINGS. I'm not a secretary, so I'm not about to type them all out, but here's one to give you an idea:

"The only instance in the NT in which the religious worship or adoration of Christ was apparently implied, has been altered by the Revision: "At the name of Jesus every knee shall bow" is now to be read "in the name". Moreover, no alteration of text or of translation will be found anywhere to make up for this loss, as indeed it is well understood that the NT contains neither precept nor example which really sanctions the religious worship of Jesus Christ."

That is W. R. Smith of the 1881 Revision committee ADMITTING that his GOAL was to COMPLETELY ELIMINATE a MAJOR DOCTRINE (worshipping Jesus Christ) from the Bible - ON PURPOSE. That was out of his own book, "Texts and Margins of the Revised NT Affecting Theological Doctrine".

Here's a few more quotes:

G. V. Smith, 1881 Revision Committee, "(Salvation) was in no way purchased of Him (God) or of his justice, it was not because his wrath was appeased or satisfied by the sufferings of an innocent substitute."

"It is equally clear that it was not as their substitute that he died for men, not to redeem them from eternal misery."

(I got the wrong initials in his earlier quote, W. R. Smith got kicked out of his college for lying to them that he would stop denying that Moses wrote the Pentateuch or the Psalms were illegitimate while he had a book being printed asserting just that while he made his promise to stop!)

W. R. Bowie, RSV NT Committee,

"Psalms ... reflect a God who is dead and ought to be dead - and was never alive except in unredeemed imagination."

"Their story of Creation could not go beyond conjecture."

H. J. Cadbury - RSV Crew ,

"He (Jesus Christ) was given to overstatement."

James Moffatt - RSV Committee,

"The writers of the New Testament made mistakes ..."

"It is still a mystery how Jesus rose ... the tales of resurrection imply&ldots;"

Bruce Metzger - RSV Chief, Condensed Bible Chief,

"the Pastorals were not written by Paul."

"the letter (2 Pet) was drawn up in Peter's name."

"flood covering the whole earth are heightened versions of local inundations."

You can find similar stuff from people on almost every modern version committee. Reading through all the stuff literally made me sick. I can understand someone who doesn't know these things supporting modern versions in ignorance, but I can't image that someone familiar with these guys, and Semler, and Griesbach, and the rest (like Xenu is), could possibly not see the work of Satan there. More than ever I doubt their professed salvation (some don't even profess it) and believe they are working for the devil, sometimes knowingly.

Semler and Griesbach are the fathers of the modern textual criticism. Westcott & Hort and the rest followed them. They both held most of the same heresies. Semler's "Accomodation Theory" says Jesus was a liar but he went along with the lies to appease His followers. Maybe that's why the modern versions make Jesus into a liar. Semler also claimed that any orthodox readings were suspect because they were probably put there by people trying to insert their views into scripture to cover errors, but unorthodox readings were probably legitimate because scripture was full of errors.

This is the FOUNDATION of ALL the MODERN VERSIONS. Not only a foundation of sand, but QUICKSAND! After knowing this stuff, I don't see how any sane, saved individual could waste one second debating the issue in their own mind before dumping the trash and settling on the KJV.

-Teno Groppi

Bible Page http://www.vbe.com/~tdg/kjv/index.html

KJV Inspired? http://www.vbe.com/~tdg/kjv/inspired.html

Bible Studies http://www.vbe.com/~tdg/kjv/study/index.html

King James Authorized Bible - The King of Books!